Comments on: More Thoughts on Tantrums

By: Dionna

Dionna — Wed, 08 Sep 2010 13:26:01 +0000

Thanks Rachel! And welcome – it sounds like you will have great things to add to our conversations :)

By: Rachel

Rachel — Wed, 08 Sep 2010 13:20:49 +0000

OK so I know I’m a bit late to the game here, I came from a more recent entry that referenced this one from some time ago but I could not help but comment :)

By: Rachel

Rachel — Wed, 08 Sep 2010 13:19:35 +0000

I am so glad that you touched on “modeling” as a way to teach children. Children learn by example. We model respect in many different ways and there are always many opportunities that life presents us parents with to use to teach our children these life lessons. Lead by example and the children will follow. One also must have a basic understanding of what a child (let’s say toddler age)is actually capable of…a two year old is operating on impulse, they may be capable of only 20% impulse control at this age. Besides, these are children, we cannot expect them to “behave” as if they were adults.

By: Dionna

Dionna — Tue, 09 Feb 2010 18:53:21 +0000

It would definitely be more difficult once you have more kids running around. And of course I can’t say how our parenting will change once (if? when?) we have a second child, but it is my desire that we continue on the road we are traveling. I do have a friend who has 3 kids (#4 on the way) who is my role model for respectful/consensual parenting, so I know that lovely children (who listen and act “appropriately” according to societal norms) can be raised gently and respectfully.

I think we’re going to have to agree to disagree on the spanking. I remember being spanked as a child (well, mostly I remember my sisters getting spanked, I didn’t get spanked nearly as much). My parents didn’t beat or “abuse” us (again, according to societal norms), but we did get spanked, and I can guarantee you that we did not accept being hit with an open heart. In my opinion, adults might *hope* kids accept physical punishment with an open heart, but that’s a projection of adult desires.

By: megan

megan — Sun, 07 Feb 2010 03:56:48 +0000

I didn’t for a moment think that you would just let him run in the streets, but I have four kids, ages 7 to 15 months and when I have all of them by myself, they must listen because that is the only way I can keep them all safe.I was thinking more along the lines when we are leaving the grocery store and they want to race through the parking lot to our car. I think that this is very hard to discuss via comments, because it is such a deep subject, especially when you start to involve more than one child. I don’t ever ignore their feelings, but if they want to through a tantrum I simple say “Please feel free to continue that behavior in your room and when you are done and would like to talk about it, come find me” that said, they are not to slam doors, or throw things, those are not acceptable behavior even if they are mad, because that behavior could result in someone else getting hurt. That behavior will have a negative consequence attached to it. If my older boys slam the door because they are mad, they have to quietly and respectfully open and shut the door twenty times. My daughter, who is three, she has to do it five times, she knows we don’t slam doors just as much a the big kids do. If they want to stomp around and pout, they have to go out into the driveway and stomp as hard as they can for 30 seconds. We need to be able to graciously accept the word “no” and respect those who say it, whether we are five or fifty. I don’t think that expectation in any way ignores the way they feel. We don’t “punish” our kids, we use discipline. If we do spank, it isn’t out of anger(that is being violent and punishing them), we talk about right and wrong and they fully understand what they did wrong, a better choice they could have made, they receive their discipline with an open heart(which may or may not include being spanked), we hug and go about our day.
I can honestly say that when I only had one I let him stay and play, but when number two came along that totally backfired and for quite awhile it was no fun to do anything because he thought he could do whatever he wanted to do and number two learn that he could do the same thing also. They never wanted to leave no matter how long they got to stay and play. It was a nightmare and it got to the point that we couldn’t go anywhere without some sort of major meltdown until we crackdown about listening, being respectful, and obeying and now I bring all four of them anywhere because I have that assurance that when it counts the most my kids will listen to me. I don’t have the same expectations for my 15 month old as my 7 year old. I don’t expect them to act like adults when they are not, but I do expect them to follow our safety rules and be obedient. As for the water in the living room, if my kids could clean it up all by themselves, that would be a different story, I don’t feel that their rights should infringe on my own. I clean up enough messes throughout the day, I don’t need to clean up an extra one when it could have been avoided by simple complying with the simple request to put it on the table. I don’t make rules to be a big meany or stick in the mud, rules are there to help everyone be happy and safe.
On a different note, I loved your post about what a boob taste like.

By: Dionna

Dionna — Sat, 06 Feb 2010 04:26:09 +0000

Thanks for stopping by and commenting, Megan.

I’m not sure if I included it in this post or the other, but of course there is a time and place for kids to listen when safety is involved. It’s a leap to think that because we don’t believe in spanking (or otherwise “disciplining” a tantrum) that we let Kieran run amok in the street. Regardless, by respecting Kieran’s right to be his own person, he listens to us of his own free will a vast majority of the time.

Respecting Kieran as a person doesn’t mean that our needs have become subservient to his. He is learning that the world is full of situations where we need to give, where we need to cooperate, where we need to listen. He may not always be happy about that – but my job isn’t to make sure he’s happy 100% of the time. We will just discuss it later after the incident is over.

But again, what good does it do me to “punish” a tantrum at that juncture? If I had to remove him from a situation against his will, I would do it gently and with respect. I would validate his feelings – because his feelings are valid. Just because I am the parent and have his best interest in mind does not mean that he should not be heard.

By: megan

megan — Sat, 06 Feb 2010 03:37:59 +0000

Your example at the store with the trains works greats, until you add in a screaming infant that needs to be fed, changed, etc. Who should be ask to wait then? We use the analogy of being under an umbrella. When mom and dad stay under God’s umbrella(i.e. respect and obey) we are safe. When our kids stay under our umbrella(i.e. respect and obey) they are safe. If we give our children the green light to do whatever they want, words lose their meaning. When I stay no, I mean no, when I stay stop, I mean stop, when I ask them to do something, I expect them to do it. They may not want to do it right now and I respect how they feel, but it still needs to be done when I ask. How would I feel if my child git hit by a car because they were exercising their so called “right” to not listen(obey) to me when I said stop? Do I pick and chose my battles, yes I do, but I still have final say.

By: Dionna

Dionna — Sat, 30 Jan 2010 16:00:05 +0000

Thank you Kaila!
And I agree – my child is *always* more important than my schedule. It’s also a learning process for me – how long will I really need to run errands today? It’s important for adults to remember to build time in for kids, b/c they just don’t can’t move as fast as we do.

By: kaila

kaila — Sat, 30 Jan 2010 15:18:25 +0000

I like what you had to say about how your household handles extreme emotions. The water story made me think; Kieran was expressing his right to say no, not to pick up the water and place it on the table. If you had taken away his right to say no, you would have been disrespecting his choice to say no. So instead you respected him, his choice to leave it and everyone showed respect for the family and home when they cleaned it.

The train story. I can relate very much. Sometimes if i just take a breathe, and realize my child is more important than my schedule, those moments of crying and upset can be avoided all together. Taking the time to listen and respect my child really does help out in the end.

If my best friend was visiting for lunch, and she starting getting upset and crying and obviously in pain, I would never ask her to leave the situation!! “Sorry bf, i can’t handle your emotions, get out!” no. I would embrace her, try to find out what is really wrong, the true reason for these strong emotions. Sending my friend away to be lonely and not heard would not solve the problem, even if the problem can’t be solved, at least listen, sometimes listening alone can help. Same as for a child, toddler, spouse, friend. Who wants to be yelled at or alone when they are expressing strong emotions?

By: Dionna

Dionna — Sat, 30 Jan 2010 14:16:30 +0000

I honestly don’t know what I’d do in each of those situations, because they’ve never come up yet. I do see the value in teaching kids that there is a time and a place to have a screaming, flailing, kicking fit, b/c it’s not safe for yourself or others to do it everywhere. And I also can see the value in asking kids to remove themselves from a dinner table (or other social situation) to tantrum, because everyone in the family has needs that should be considered – not just the one having problems at that second. At this point in his development, I don’t even think Kieran would remove himself from a room, but I would feel comfortable taking him and sitting with him elsewhere.

I have asked Kieran to go into another room to scream because he is hurting my ears – but that’s not in the middle of a tantrum. That’s just because I’m sensitive to really high noise levels. ;)